Comments on: What’s in a Death Penalty? http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/ MMO game development Fri, 12 Mar 2010 17:16:44 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Vince http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-48522 Vince Fri, 12 Mar 2010 17:16:44 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-48522 "In fact, I would have been stuck at that graveyard forever, except for a glitch in WoW that they’ve never bothered to fix: if you log out and log back in, your ghost can then travel to a different graveyard spot and respawn there instead. But you have to log out and log back in first, and you have to know about this trick. This is well-known among a certain part of WoW’s audience, but is certainly not known to everybody playing WoW. And when a game’s death penalty can result in effective perma-death of your character (unless you know how to exploit a bug), it’s hard to call your death penalty “casual”" Wow, I didn't know that. I wish I would have learned that a couple of years ago...would have saved me many, many, many headaches! “In fact, I would have been stuck at that graveyard forever, except for a glitch in WoW that they’ve never bothered to fix: if you log out and log back in, your ghost can then travel to a different graveyard spot and respawn there instead. But you have to log out and log back in first, and you have to know about this trick. This is well-known among a certain part of WoW’s audience, but is certainly not known to everybody playing WoW. And when a game’s death penalty can result in effective perma-death of your character (unless you know how to exploit a bug), it’s hard to call your death penalty “casual””

Wow, I didn’t know that. I wish I would have learned that a couple of years ago…would have saved me many, many, many headaches!

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-27775 Jeremy Mon, 27 Jul 2009 22:45:40 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-27775 This article really had me thinking about my old Asheron's Call days. I'm a big time WoW player, but I have always found it's death penalty to be extremely lenient compared to AC1, where death cost you money, items, and a cumulative penalty to your stats that had to be worked off. Some of the scariest, and most interesting, times in my AC career were doing corpse runs for myself or others, because, if you died more than once in at a time in a dangerous area, you could run the risk of permanently losing hard earned items, that could never be regained (as a side note to those unfamiliar, items in AC1 were completely random, with drops having their stats determined on drop. This made items with the proper high end stats, with lower quality to be properly tinkered, extremely rare, and, in a way, irreplaceable, unlike items in WoW, which could easily be regained in the usual raid dungeon the next week). With the "vitae" penalty, which deducted 5% of all your stats each time you died, and was burned off by earning experience, you could find yourself in very serious situations from dying, as you not only lost several of your items, possibly your weapons or armor, or both, you also became a weaker character at the base level, making it harder and harder to get your things back from your corpse each time you died. Thus, you *had* to rely on other players in your monarchy, or kind players in town, to help you get your things back if the situation got bad. This made death a very important part of the game, and not an extremely minor setback as we see in WoW. This article really had me thinking about my old Asheron’s Call days. I’m a big time WoW player, but I have always found it’s death penalty to be extremely lenient compared to AC1, where death cost you money, items, and a cumulative penalty to your stats that had to be worked off. Some of the scariest, and most interesting, times in my AC career were doing corpse runs for myself or others, because, if you died more than once in at a time in a dangerous area, you could run the risk of permanently losing hard earned items, that could never be regained (as a side note to those unfamiliar, items in AC1 were completely random, with drops having their stats determined on drop. This made items with the proper high end stats, with lower quality to be properly tinkered, extremely rare, and, in a way, irreplaceable, unlike items in WoW, which could easily be regained in the usual raid dungeon the next week). With the “vitae” penalty, which deducted 5% of all your stats each time you died, and was burned off by earning experience, you could find yourself in very serious situations from dying, as you not only lost several of your items, possibly your weapons or armor, or both, you also became a weaker character at the base level, making it harder and harder to get your things back from your corpse each time you died. Thus, you *had* to rely on other players in your monarchy, or kind players in town, to help you get your things back if the situation got bad. This made death a very important part of the game, and not an extremely minor setback as we see in WoW.

]]> By: my blog http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-25907 my blog Thu, 02 Jul 2009 12:47:13 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-25907 <strong>check this out...</strong> this is mine... check this out…

this is mine…

]]> By: Dugi's Daily Quests Guide http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-20941 Dugi's Daily Quests Guide Sat, 25 Apr 2009 18:29:05 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-20941 I liked the dealth peniltys in the old games where you had a chance to drop one gold or an item when you were killed. I liked the dealth peniltys in the old games where you had a chance to drop one gold or an item when you were killed.

]]> By: Death Penalties « Bio Break http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-17015 Death Penalties « Bio Break Mon, 16 Feb 2009 20:58:15 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-17015 [...] penalties (I’m not in the mood for grouchy debates with trolls today, thank you, and besides, Elder Game did a great job with the topic last year), I thought it’d be pretty interesting to look back at past MMOs, and how [...] [...] penalties (I’m not in the mood for grouchy debates with trolls today, thank you, and besides, Elder Game did a great job with the topic last year), I thought it’d be pretty interesting to look back at past MMOs, and how [...]

]]> By: billie http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-1427 billie Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:47:09 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-1427 oh the iraq war was stupid oh the iraq war was stupid

]]> By: billie http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-1426 billie Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:46:41 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-1426 iraq iraq

]]> By: Geek Studies » Blog Archive » More on Death in Games http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-1140 Geek Studies » Blog Archive » More on Death in Games Thu, 06 Mar 2008 17:26:34 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-1140 [...] the Death Penalty: Elder Game ponders the differences between how World of Warcraft and Everquest penalize players for dying. I [...] [...] the Death Penalty: Elder Game ponders the differences between how World of Warcraft and Everquest penalize players for dying. I [...]

]]> By: amuseum http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-1131 amuseum Thu, 06 Mar 2008 00:41:08 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-1131 One, I don't like corpse runs at all. It's too time-consuming, plus the fact most MMOs are already slow and boring. Two, in WoW you could not choose your graveyard. One, AC2 did not have corpse runs. You returned to the last bound lifestone and lost vitae, which was recoverable by XP only, not time. However, there were classes who could undo the vitae loss. Two, you could choose which lifestone to bind to. Though if you didn't choose wisely, you could get camped in PVP. Third, you can teleport back to the last portal you ran through, provided you or a buddy have put points into portal recall or portal summon. But the point is, you have many choices to where you want to start again. In GW, it was hard to beat an instance at 60%, esp. solo. Usually it was easier to start over and call a few friends or hire more NPCs and play smarter the next time. Dying already makes one feel bad because nobody likes losing. But to add salt to the wounds, devs would impose harsh and tedious death penalties. There is a DS game called Zendoku, which is like Sudoku, but with pictures. You play against the AI. When one completes a box or row or whatever, the other player is punished by entering a minigame until they beat it. This takes time away from solving the Sudoku and messes with one's concentration. There is one minigame that is sometimes unbeatable by the human player, requiring very quick reflexes, such that one would never complete the Sudoku because he is stuck in the minigame. One, I don’t like corpse runs at all. It’s too time-consuming, plus the fact most MMOs are already slow and boring. Two, in WoW you could not choose your graveyard.

One, AC2 did not have corpse runs. You returned to the last bound lifestone and lost vitae, which was recoverable by XP only, not time. However, there were classes who could undo the vitae loss. Two, you could choose which lifestone to bind to. Though if you didn’t choose wisely, you could get camped in PVP. Third, you can teleport back to the last portal you ran through, provided you or a buddy have put points into portal recall or portal summon. But the point is, you have many choices to where you want to start again.

In GW, it was hard to beat an instance at 60%, esp. solo. Usually it was easier to start over and call a few friends or hire more NPCs and play smarter the next time.

Dying already makes one feel bad because nobody likes losing. But to add salt to the wounds, devs would impose harsh and tedious death penalties. There is a DS game called Zendoku, which is like Sudoku, but with pictures. You play against the AI. When one completes a box or row or whatever, the other player is punished by entering a minigame until they beat it. This takes time away from solving the Sudoku and messes with one’s concentration. There is one minigame that is sometimes unbeatable by the human player, requiring very quick reflexes, such that one would never complete the Sudoku because he is stuck in the minigame.

]]> By: Jessie http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/whats-in-a-death-penalty/comment-page-1/#comment-802 Jessie Thu, 07 Feb 2008 03:02:32 +0000 http://www.eldergame.com/2007/12/17/whats-in-a-death-penalty/#comment-802 <strong>Jessie...</strong> I love the info and have bookmarked your blog. Haver you thought of doing a vlog describing this stuff?... Jessie…

I love the info and have bookmarked your blog. Haver you thought of doing a vlog describing this stuff?…

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